Tradition badges! Skulls, eagles and more.....!

[Sergeant 08]

I like to collect German tradition badges / unit badges etc. ww2! Use this thread to post and discuss the things in your collection! Unit badges, visor cap badges, photos with a relation to these things ...

I will start with my last favourite: A zinc Schwedter Adler!

[Sergeant 08]

Zinc Edelweiss!

[Sergeant 08]

26. Panzer Division

[Sergeant 08]

Jaeger!

[Sergeant 08]

Ski Jaeger

[Sergeant 08]

KR5 zinc skull

[Sergeant 08]

KR13

[Adrian Stevenson]

Hi, I share your interst in these kind of badges. The Schwedter Adler is a badge I would really like to obtain for my collection.

The best I can offer for this thread is a beer mug from Christmas 1940. AA34 was one of the units authorised to wear the Schwedter Adler.

Cheers, Ade.

[Sergeant 08]

The Schwedter Adler is a badge I would really like to obtain for my collection.

And this beer mug I would really like to obtain for my collection! :thumbup:

Here is another Schwedter Adler (with prongs that were placed in centre). If you look carefully at the photo, you can see that it was lacquered (Zapon).

[Sergeant 08]

Private purchased zinc Edelweiss for field caps.

[Sergeant 08]

The RAD used the Edelweiss too!

[wilhelm saris]

Yes, but this Austrian guy does wear the army version (which also was worn as form-II by police-batallions, the ORPO-staff at Norway and at the inspection of the ORPO at Salzburg).

The RAD in Austria had its "own" official version, which was authorized and granted by Hierl July 12, 1938. It was one of the official RAD traditions-cap badges. No other organization did wear this RAD-form.
The wearing was allowed to the districts XXXIII, Alpenland; XXXIV, Oberdonau, XXXV, Niederdonau (the later Wien-Niederdonau) and XXXVI, Südmark.

I did write various extensive articles about the RAD traditions-cap badges for some German magazines.

[Sergeant 08]

Yes, but this Austrian guy does wear the army version

That is why I like this photo and the reason why I posted it. :wink:

[Sergeant 08]

More Edelweiss!

[Sergeant 08]

Private purchased Jaeger cap badge (With green back material like the one in my posting#4!).

[Sergeant 08]

Edelweiss on a Zoll cap.

[derjager]

An Edelweiss cap badge for the Kyffhäuserbund. I have no inwear picture. Would anyone have one?

--dj--Joe USMC.

[Sergeant 08]

An Edelweiss cap badge for the Kyffhäuserbund. I have no inwear picture. Would anyone have one?

--dj--Joe USMC.

I have seen it on a cap, but I have no photo of this badge in wear.

[Sergeant 08]

Here is one of the clearest photos of the Schwedter Adler that I have ever seen. It looks like the pattern with the smaller crown.

[Sergeant 08]

A photo (not from my collection) that shows the two main patterns of the Schwedter Adler ww2 (notice the different details for example the crown etc).

[Sergeant 08]

This IR17 soldier seems to wear the skull pattern with bigger eye holes made by Assmann.

[Sergeant 08]

Here is a similar skull (Cupal) in my collection. It is a variant with unusual prongs.

[Sergeant 08]

Edelweiss on the SA cap.

[Sergeant 08]

Wehrmacht visor cap Edelweiss.

[Sergeant 08]

Let us see more things! :tongue_smilie:

[derjager]

Does the F. W. Assmann catalog state what organization or use was intended for 17881, 17433 and 16460?

--dj--Joe USMC.

[Kuratorium45]

Kav.Rgt.5 skull in wear :

[Kuratorium45]

Unusual HJ cap Edelweiss :

[Kuratorium45]

And next WH visor cap Edelweiss :

[wilhelm saris]

no the text for page 65 mentions the section to be insignia of any kind, the numbers you mention simply as death head's. Some are also to be found with army. This is in all cataloques from Assmann the same (I don have 4 different ones).
16460 is with Wehrmacht-Reichsheer, page 4 names as traditions-insignia.
Further no explanation.

[Sergeant 08]

Does the F. W. Assmann catalog state what organization or use was intended for 17881, 17433 and 16460?

--dj--Joe USMC.

16460 is the flat Brunswick skull (the issued skull pattern from Imperial times) rarer to find on Wehrmacht caps than the other type. I posted it already in a thread. Here is another card board with this skull (and the skull in wear).

[Sergeant 08]

The other skulls were in use as tradtion skull by different organizations. For example skull 20955 was similar to find on Wehrwolf uniforms etc.

[Kuratorium45]

Ex Legion Condor tank unit member :

[Kuratorium45]

Another Kav.Rgt.5 member :

[Sergeant 08]

Ex Legion Condor tank unit member :

That is a really interesting and rare photo! Thanks for posting :thumbup:

PS: I think I have a similar one still saved on my computer. I will search it!

[Sergeant 08]

Another Kav.Rgt.5 member :

The skull on the cap looks comparable like the skull pattern from the Berlin hoard.

[Kuratorium45]

DRK mountain rescue member :

[Sergeant 08]

DRK mountain rescue member :

I have never seen it before on a DRK cap.

[Sergeant 08]

Legion Condor with skull on the cap and badge for tank troops. What is the meaning of the star on the cap?

[Sergeant 08]

The RAD had a lot of nice tradition badges too.

Mecklenburg!

[Kuratorium45]

Legion Condor with skull on the cap and badge for tank troops. What is the meaning of the star on the cap?

Is a LC oficer rank, based on spain pattern IMHO...

[wilhelm saris]

Upon the breast the backing for the star could be carmine, for artillery it was red, medial was dark-blue. Other colors do not fit as the one shown is dark and not light.
The star upon his breast and baret has six points. With six it is for an Unteroffizier with Portepee (Sargento primero). When his star would have had eight point then it was a Hauptmann (Capitan).
I think this is largely as it should be!

[wilhelm saris]

carmine = tank crew

[Jo_Rivett]

Legion Condor with skull on the cap and badge for tank troops. What is the meaning of the star on the cap?
Here are a few More condor-star-on-cap pictures courtesy of Life.
HERE (http://images.google.com/hosted/life/f?q=Legion+Condor+source:life&prev=/images%3Fq%3DLegion%2BCondor%2Bsource:life%26hl%3D en&imgurl=f1ecc178266a4d1b), HERE (http://images.google.com/hosted/life/f?q=Legion+Condor+source:life&prev=/images%3Fq%3DLegion%2BCondor%2Bsource:life%26ndsp% 3D18%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26start%3D18&imgurl=3383cccdf1d1c998), HERE (http://images.google.com/hosted/life/f?q=Legion+Condor+source:life&prev=/images%3Fq%3DLegion%2BCondor%2Bsource:life%26ndsp% 3D18%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26start%3D18&imgurl=68e9bd535c7048fb) & HERE (http://images.google.com/hosted/life/f?q=Legion+Condor+source:life&prev=/images%3Fq%3DLegion%2BCondor%2Bsource:life%26ndsp% 3D18%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26start%3D36&imgurl=fa1a3bce08dd005f).

[Sergeant 08]

Is a LC oficer rank, based on spain pattern IMHO...

Upon the breast the backing for the star could be carmine, for artillery it was red, medial was dark-blue. Other colors do not fit as the one shown is dark and not light.
The star upon his breast and baret has six points. With six it is for an Unteroffizier with Portepee (Sargento primero). When his star would have had eight point then it was a Hauptmann (Capitan).
I think this is largely as it should be!

Thanks for the info!

[Sergeant 08]

What is the meaning of this SS skull on the tunic?

[Sergeant 08]

Comments, thoughts? ;)

[Robin Lumsden]

What is the meaning of this SS skull on the tunic?


This soldier was the son of the former Duke of Brunswick (I can't remember his name at the moment)...............he served as an enlisted man in the Heer before being commissioned as an officer and wore the TK in remembrance of the old Braunschweiger truppen.

[Sergeant 08]

and wore the TK in remembrance of the old Braunschweiger truppen.

SS skull in remembrance of the old Braunschweiger? Really? The young soldiers! What comes next? :wink:

[Kuratorium45]

...and what is the meaning of this little tank pin on the tunic left ?
(old eBay auction photo)

[Robin Lumsden]

SS skull in remembrance of the old Braunschweiger? Really? The young soldiers! What comes next? :wink:


I've remembered his name.

He's Prinz Ernst-August von Hannover, in 1940.

The TK Husar on the horse was his ancestor..............same name.

His son was also Ernst-August.

[Sergeant 08]

I've remembered his name.

He's Prinz Ernst-August von Hannover, in 1940.

The TK Husar on the horse was his ancestor..............same name.

His son was also Ernst-August.

It is Ernst August von Hannover (1914–1987), isn't it?

[Sergeant 08]

...and what is the meaning of this little tank pin on the tunic left ?
(old eBay auction photo)

I have no idea, why this SS guy wore such a tank pin on his tunic. Today German soldiers wear such inofficial pins on caps (tank driver for example).

[Sergeant 08]

For the interested collectors! Here is a picture of a skull tradition badge in the book 'Deutsche Uniformen' (I think first published in the 40's.).

[wilhelm saris]

Maybe this is for your interest: colored plate with the stand of August 1, 1936 phrased as Uniformen des deutschen Heeres (Bekleidungs-, Ausrüstungsstücke, Hoheitsabzeichen, Troddeln und Faustriemen).

Three Erinnerungsabzeichen were shown with this plate.

[wilhelm saris]

The text about the Erinnerungsabzeichen, as published in the uniform-booklet:
Das Deutsche Reichsheer/Die deutsche Reichswehr with the stand of May 9, 1930.

[wilhelm saris]

And the text as was published in the H.Dv.122, Abschnitt A, better known as Anzugsordnung für das Reichsheer, with the stand of November 14, 1934.

[Sergeant 08]

Thanks for the picture and texts, Wilhelm! :thumbup:

The texts show the evolution of the Schwedler Adler. In the Reichswehr it was worn without crown and motto. Later in the Wehrmacht (I think in December 1933) the crown and motto came back. The eagle looked again like in Imperial times.

PS: I have never seen such a Reichswehr Schwedter Adler!?

[wilhelm saris]

I hoped you noticed the difference (which is in the text). I think the one not having the crown is quite rare!

[Sergeant 08]

Here is a Hochland Edelweiss for SA etc.!

[derjager]

I have seen a number of variatiants of the Hochland Edelweiss on sale sites. Were there variants or are there a number of reproductions floating about?

--dj--Joe USMC.

[wilhelm saris]

Yes, there are some with slight variations and be sure it is being faked.
I am aware of that fact since over 30-35 years....

[Sergeant 08]

I have seen a number of variatiants of the Hochland Edelweiss on sale sites. Were there variants or are there a number of reproductions floating about?

--dj--Joe USMC.

Variants existed. No doubt, all kinds of interesting things were faked. :wink:

[Sergeant 08]

Just seen on ebay.

[wilhelm saris]

I think it does not belong there, as Kyffhäuser had its own version. I think someone thought to make the cap more rare by adding it! And so make more money.

[Sergeant 08]

I think it does not belong there, as Kyffhäuser had its own version. I think someone thought to make the cap more rare by adding it! And so make more money.

Inside is a lettering of the Deutsche Arbeitsfront (DAF) not Kyffhäuser.

[wilhelm saris]

Sorry, I did not look well. The DAF had never granted the wearing of the Edelweiss. In none of the regulations (Amtsblatt) I have seen such a note.

My head was swimming, maybe, due to the quick ending of the contest. And by this I had overseen the DAF tag

[Sergeant 08]

Sorry, I did not look well. The DAF had never granted the wearing of the Edelweiss. In none of the regulations (Amtsblatt) I have seen such a note.

My head was swimming, maybe, due to the quick ending of the contest. And by this I had overseen the DAF tag

No problem! These caps look very similar like Kyffhäuser caps. ;)

[Sergeant 08]

On ebay is a nest of Edelweiss caps. :lol:

[Sergeant 08]

I have seen a number of variatiants of the Hochland Edelweiss on sale sites.

--dj--Joe USMC.

More!

[wilhelm saris]

I would like to give some additional photographs with the wearing of an Edelweiss-flower.

The youngsters are from the Orphanage Potsdam and its sub-locations:
first shown the use of an Edelweiss, not having a swastika, positioned as according to the army. The lad is from the Militär-Waisenhaus at Liebenau, for that he has the abbreviation MWL upon his shoulder-straps. The worn uniform was in the style as for the army, as while these institutions were under the patronage of the army, but no eagle upon the tunic. The army eagle is on top of the visored cap;
two youngsters wearing a field-cap with Soutache as in the style for the army. The lower part is the darker-green as for the army, the top is a greenish-olive colored cloth. The lad is wearing the SA-style of Edelweiss, as regularly also worn within the Hitler-Youth.
He also if from the Austrian institution at Liebenau. The lad at right is from the Grosses Militär-Waisenhaus at Potsdam near Berlin. This is shown with the abbreviation MWP upon the shoulder-straps.

They are anyway younger as the earlier shown boy. He wears a tunic with one row of buttons; the two do wear the tunic with two rows, meaning they are from the so-called "Kinderhaus", the younger childrens section.

[derjager]

I appreciate the reply's.

--dj--Joe USMC.

[benten]

I'm not sure if this Edelweiss is a tradition badge.

benten

[Sergeant 08]

I'm not sure if this Edelweiss is a tradition badge.

benten

It looks like a Hochland Edelweiss pattern with enameled swastika. Markings?

[wilhelm saris]

It's a Hochland. In most regulations for the SA, for example the 1934 dress-regulation, not even it is said it is a traditions-badge. Likewise nothing about tradition was said on the well-known Eelking.
But you can consider it to be one, as it was worn in traditions.

[benten]

The badge has no mark.
Thank you for your reply gentlemen.

benten

[Sergeant 08]

I read, this is a tradition cap badge of the RAD in Baden.

[wilhelm saris]

Yes, this is correct, actually for the Arbeitsgau XXVII, Baden-Pfalz.

It was granted Aunust 14, 1934, so actually for the FAD and continued to be worn within the RAD. Information in the book Angolia/Littlejohn about the traditions cap badges is largely not correct. Anyway about the introduction date.

I see this one is aluminum, so the version from about 1936 and later. The first form was from neusilber.
The wearing officially only was allowed for the so-called Robin Hood-cap.

[Sergeant 08]

A lot of different RAD tradition cap badges were made. Here is one from Niedersachsen.

[Sergeant 08]

Mecklenburg!

[wilhelm saris]

Fourteen official RAD traditions cap badges were granted; seventeen districts were authorized to wear one (four did wear the same Edelweiss, the RAD specific form).
At the moment all about these RAD insignia a series is being published in the German magazin "Internationales Militaria-Magazin". The first two in-depth parts already were published:
nr.138 from April/May 2009 and nr.139 July/August 2009. The third part will come soon. The article shows all kinds of variations and many of the badges in wear. Also the "history" is being told about!
When I collected them I owned about 65 of them in variations (material and attaching method). All were sold last year November.

[Sergeant 08]

Fourteen official RAD traditions cap badges were granted; seventeen districts were authorized to wear one (four did wear the same Edelweiss, the RAD specific form).
At the moment all about these RAD insignia a series is being published in the German magazin "Internationales Militaria-Magazin". The first two in-depth parts already were published:
nr.138 from April/May 2009 and nr.139 July/August 2009. The third part will come soon. The article shows all kinds of variations and many of the badges in wear. Also the "history" is being told about!
When I collected them I owned about 65 of them in variations (material and attaching method). All were sold last year November.

More than 65 and variations? I'm sure this collection was nice! Up to now I'm not sure about starting to collect RAD tradition badges. Maybe I will start, after I was bored to collect only variations of Wehrmacht tradition badges. :)

[wilhelm saris]

Maybe your interest will come when you have read about all of them in the fifth volume in the headgear-series "Headgear of Hitlers Germany". It will take maybe up to two years before the book will be out, but in the chapter about RAD all will be dealt with in depth with all of its variations, sizes, wearing and the story behind them and more!

[Sergeant 08]

Maybe your interest will come when you have read about all of them in the fifth volume in the headgear-series "Headgear of Hitlers Germany"

It is possible! :thumbup:

[Sergeant 08]

Especially I like the worn Wehrmacht badges with character like this one :wink:

[Sergeant 08]

In #79 I posted the RAD tradition badge Niedersachsen. Here is it in wear!

[Sergeant 08]

Very sharp photos of the Schwedter Adler in wear.

[Sergeant 08]

Sometimes you can find Schwedter Adler stick pins. Some sellers say, those were used for visor caps, too. I believe they were only used for wearing on civil clothes. Opinions?

[Sergeant 08]

Another

[Sergeant 08]

Again a Wehrmacht soldier who used a tank skull on his cap. It looks like a 9 on his shoulder board. Thoughts about the photo?

[Sergeant 08]

And what has this guy from Innsbruck on his cap? Edelweiß, I guess?

[wilhelm saris]

Am 25. Juli 1941 wurden für die Angehörigen der ORPO im Hochgebirge besondere Edelweiss-Abzeichen eingeführt, die mit Wirkung vom 1. November 1941 getragen werden durften. Am 8. August 1941 wurde durch einen Sondererlass geregent welche Teile der Hochgebirgsgendarmerie das Edelweissanzeichen an der Bergmütze tragen durften.
Es gab die Form I und II:
Form I durfte nur von der Polizei-Kompanie Innsbrück, den Hochgebirgsrevier Innsbruck und der Hochgebirgsgendarmerie getragen werden, später auch noch auf das Polizei-Gebirgs-Jägeregiment ausgedehnt (14. Mai 1942). Am 4. Dezember 1944 erhielt ausserdem das Stammpersonal der Polizeischule für Hochgebirgsausbildung die Trageberechtigung;
Form II wurde von den mit Gebirgsausrüstung ausgestatteten Polizei-Bataillonen (z.B. 251, 252, 253, 255, 256, 302 und 312 und Halbbatallion Grong) getragen. Auch wurde diese Form von den Angehörigen des Stabes der Orpo in Norwegen und des Inspekteurs der Orpo in Salzburg getragen. Ferner wurde diese Form getragen von allen Skilehrgangsteilnehmern und Skiwettkämpfern der Orpo während der Dauer der Lehrgänge und Wettkämpfe getragen.

Form I = das Edelweiss wie beim Heer;
Form II = das Edelweiss wie von der SA getragen.

I do not have the time to translate the whole lot of information.

[wilhelm saris]

The information about who had to wear what Edelweiss was explained in-depth in an article in two parts in the MILITARIA-magazine from Patzwall, Germany in May-June 2000 and September-October 2000,
So now about ten years ago. I know not much people do subscribe magazines due to the costs, but much information they are looking for already was noted in whatever French, American or German magazine.